Re: [MW:35006] Difference of 2% of Chromium Content on the Actual PMI VS Sec IIA

Sirs,

Do we have supporting verses in ASME?

Thanks

On Thursday, May 16, 2024 at 5:58:42 PM UTC+8 Mohamed Ali wrote:

Kindly get client specification for the same as they have mentioned the acceptance criteria in the same.

Many clients are acceptable the tolarnce range is +- 10%.

In this case Chromium range between 19.8 to 28.6 is acceptable. 

On Thu, 16 May 2024, 11:53 am Ahmed Fouad, <dah...@gmail.com> wrote:

You can make a weight analysis to insure the real content of Cr.

Knowing that this test is a destructive test.

thank you

‫في الخميس، 16 مايو 2024 في 9:35 ص تمت كتابة ما يلي بواسطة ‪Macario Jr. Palola‬‏ <‪macario...@gmec.ph‬‏>:‬

Sirs,

May I ask your valuable inputs with regards to my queries.

Base on the attached report, the actual value of %Cr is 20% as per PMI and the value of %Cr in ASME Sec IIA. Now my question, is this acceptable or not ?

Thank you in advance.

Regards,

Mac

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[MW:35006] Impact test

Dear team

   What is impact test? , what is the reason to do that?, how to select impact temperature for each material?, 

Non aramco and aramco 

Thanks & Best Regards
Saleem manhappulath

Mob:+966533595849
WhatsApp:+919526445936

From iPhone xs

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Re: [MW:35008] Impact test

MDMT 

On Fri, May 17, 2024 at 9:50 AM saleem manhappulath <saleemm9526@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear team

   What is impact test? , what is the reason to do that?, how to select impact temperature for each material?, 

Non aramco and aramco 

Thanks & Best Regards
Saleem manhappulath

Mob:+966533595849
WhatsApp:+919526445936

From iPhone xs

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Re: [MW:35009] Impact test

Refer ASME SEC VIII DIV1 UCS 66 

On Fri, 17 May 2024, 9:50 am saleem manhappulath, <saleemm9526@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear team

   What is impact test? , what is the reason to do that?, how to select impact temperature for each material?, 

Non aramco and aramco 

Thanks & Best Regards
Saleem manhappulath

Mob:+966533595849
WhatsApp:+919526445936

From iPhone xs

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[MW:35009] Consumable & PWHT for 16Mo3 material

Greetings Experts,

I would like to know more about PQR qualifications for Boiler tube material EN 10216-2 16Mo3 or SA 209 T1 with 6.5mm Thick,

Welding Consumable: Should  I qualify the above material with ER80S-B2/ E8018-B2 or ER80S-D2 / E7018-A1, or which consumable is suitable for high temperature service like Boiler.

PWHT: As per ASME SEC.I & VIII PWHT is not mandatory for P. No.1 Gr.1 up to 16mm Thick and the Boiler tube and weld joints will undergo the Stress Relieving after tube bending as a coil. in this case Should i qualify the PQR with PWHT or Without PWHT.

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Re: [MW:35012] Impact test

Please refer ASME IIA  SA-370   /  ASTM A 370

Thanks & Regards

J.Gerald Jayakumar

0091-8838619635

On Friday, 17 May, 2024 at 09:50:11 am IST, saleem manhappulath <saleemm9526@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear team

   What is impact test? , what is the reason to do that?, how to select impact temperature for each material?, 

Non aramco and aramco 

Thanks & Best Regards
Saleem manhappulath

Mob:+966533595849
WhatsApp:+919526445936

From iPhone xs

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Re: [MW:35009] Difference of 2% of Chromium Content on the Actual PMI VS Sec IIA

Plz refer attach 

Thank and regards

Dinesh Baskaran

On Thu, 16 May, 2024, 12:05 pm Macario Jr. Palola, <macario.palola@gmec.ph> wrote:

Sirs,

May I ask your valuable inputs with regards to my queries.

Base on the attached report, the actual value of %Cr is 20% as per PMI and the value of %Cr in ASME Sec IIA. Now my question, is this acceptable or not ?

Thank you in advance.

Regards,

Mac

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Re: [MW:35013] Consumable & PWHT for 16Mo3 material

Dear Sudalai,

PQR (Procedure Qualification Record) for Boiler Tube Material

For the given materials EN 10216-2 16Mo3 or SA 209 T1 with a thickness of 6.5mm, it's important to consider the appropriate welding consumables, the need for Post Weld Heat Treatment (PWHT), and compliance with relevant standards to ensure the reliability and performance of the welded joints, especially in high-temperature service conditions like those found in boilers.

Welding Consumables

Material Overview:

• EN 10216-2 16Mo3: This is a European specification for seamless tubes of fine-grain steel with specified elevated temperature properties.
• SA 209 T1: This is an ASME specification for seamless carbon-molybdenum alloy-steel boiler and superheater tubes.

Recommended Welding Consumables:

• ER80S-B2 / E8018-B2: These consumables are suitable for welding low alloy steels containing 1.25% Cr and 0.5% Mo, typically used for high-temperature service. They provide good creep resistance and strength at elevated temperatures.
• ER80S-D2 / E7018-A1: These consumables are typically used for carbon-manganese and carbon-molybdenum steels. E7018-A1 is a low-hydrogen electrode suitable for general welding applications but may not provide the necessary high-temperature properties required for boiler tubes.

Considering the service conditions (high temperature) and the material composition, ER80S-B2 / E8018-B2 would be the preferred choice for welding 16Mo3 and SA 209 T1 materials due to their enhanced high-temperature performance.

Post Weld Heat Treatment (PWHT)

Code Requirements:

• ASME Section I & Section VIII: These sections cover the construction of boilers and pressure vessels. For P-Number 1, Group 1 materials, PWHT is not mandatory for thicknesses up to 16mm.

Practical Considerations:

• Stress Relieving after Tube Bending: If the boiler tubes and welded joints will undergo stress relieving after tube bending, this process itself serves as a form of PWHT. Stress relieving can help reduce residual stresses and improve the metallurgical properties of the welded joints.
• Qualification with or without PWHT: Given that stress relieving will be performed after tube bending, you may qualify the PQR without PWHT. However, it is crucial to simulate the actual service conditions during qualification. If stress relieving (acting as PWHT) is a part of the production process, it's recommended to qualify the PQR considering this process to ensure the welding procedure aligns with the final product conditions.

Conclusion

1. Welding Consumable Selection: For high-temperature service like boilers, ER80S-B2 / E8018-B2 consumables are suitable for welding EN 10216-2 16Mo3 and SA 209 T1 materials.
2. PWHT Requirement: Since the boiler tubes and weld joints will undergo stress relieving after tube bending, which serves as a form of PWHT, you may qualify the PQR without PWHT. However, it is advisable to ensure the PQR qualification reflects the stress relieving process to simulate actual service conditions.

By adhering to these guidelines, you can ensure the welds are properly qualified and suitable for the high-temperature service conditions typical in boiler applications.

Regards,

AB

On Fri, 17 May 2024 at 12:14, Sudalai Kannan <sudalaims@gmail.com> wrote:

Greetings Experts,

I would like to know more about PQR qualifications for Boiler tube material EN 10216-2 16Mo3 or SA 209 T1 with 6.5mm Thick,

Welding Consumable: Should  I qualify the above material with ER80S-B2/ E8018-B2 or ER80S-D2 / E7018-A1, or which consumable is suitable for high temperature service like Boiler.

PWHT: As per ASME SEC.I & VIII PWHT is not mandatory for P. No.1 Gr.1 up to 16mm Thick and the Boiler tube and weld joints will undergo the Stress Relieving after tube bending as a coil. in this case Should i qualify the PQR with PWHT or Without PWHT.

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Amol K.B

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Re: [MW:35013] Impact test

Dear Saleem,

An impact test measures a material's ability to absorb energy and resist breaking under sudden impacts or shock loads. It evaluates the toughness or the energy-absorbing capacity of materials, typically metals, when subjected to a high strain rate. The most common types of impact tests are the Charpy and Izod tests.

Reasons for Conducting an Impact Test

1. Safety: Ensures materials used in critical applications (e.g., construction, automotive, aerospace) can withstand sudden forces or shocks without catastrophic failure.
2. Material Selection: Helps in choosing the right materials for specific environmental conditions and stresses.
3. Quality Control: Verifies the consistency and reliability of materials during manufacturing.
4. Performance Prediction: Predicts how materials will behave in real-world situations involving dynamic loads.

How to Select Impact Temperature for Each Material

Selecting the impact temperature for testing depends on the following factors:

1. Service Conditions: The test temperature should reflect the lowest temperature at which the material is expected to perform in service. This is crucial for applications in cold environments.
2. Material Properties: Different materials have different ductile-to-brittle transition temperatures. This transition temperature is a critical point where the material changes from ductile behavior to brittle behavior.
3. Industry Standards: Follow relevant standards (e.g., ASTM, ISO) which often specify the testing temperature for different materials and applications.
4. Historical Data: Use previous data or experiences with similar materials to determine appropriate test temperatures.

Impact Testing in Aramco vs. Non-Aramco Contexts

Aramco-Specific Requirements:

Saudi Aramco, as a major global energy company, has stringent requirements for materials used in its projects. These requirements are outlined in its engineering standards and specifications. For impact testing, Aramco might specify:

1. Specific Temperatures: Depending on the project location and operational environment (e.g., desert, offshore), Aramco may mandate certain test temperatures.
2. Material Grades: For critical infrastructure, Aramco may require higher grades of materials with proven impact resistance.
3. Testing Protocols: Compliance with Aramco's detailed testing protocols and documentation to ensure material performance and reliability.

Non-Aramco Contexts:

In non-Aramco contexts, impact testing requirements may vary widely depending on the industry and governing standards. General industry practices include:

1. Adherence to National/International Standards: Follow standards like ASTM (American Society for Testing and Materials) or ISO (International Organization for Standardization) for impact testing procedures.
2. Company-Specific Standards: Companies might have their own engineering standards, which may be less stringent compared to Aramco, based on the application and risk assessment.
3. Flexible Criteria: Depending on the criticality of the application, the criteria for impact testing (including test temperatures) may be more flexible.

In summary, impact tests are crucial for assessing material toughness under sudden loads, ensuring safety, and guiding material selection. The testing temperature is selected based on service conditions, material properties, standards, and historical data. While Aramco has stringent requirements due to its operational environments and critical infrastructure needs, non-Aramco contexts may follow more general or less stringent standards.

Regards,

AB

On Fri, 17 May 2024 at 09:50, saleem manhappulath <saleemm9526@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear team

   What is impact test? , what is the reason to do that?, how to select impact temperature for each material?, 

Non aramco and aramco 

Thanks & Best Regards
Saleem manhappulath

Mob:+966533595849
WhatsApp:+919526445936

From iPhone xs

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Re: [MW:35015] Consumable & PWHT for 16Mo3 material

Dear Amol, 

Thanks for your prompt reply.

I Agree with your conclusion for the welding consumable and I will proceed with the PQR for ER80S-B2 / E8018-B2.

I would like to know more about PWHT for P No.3 G.1 or Equivalent since it is required to stress relieve only the bend portion as per construction code, whereas in my case the weld joint may or may not undergo stress relieving.

As long as the SR is performed in the furnace, the whole coil with weld joint will undergo the process. if the SR is performed in localized only the bend portion will undergo stress relieving.

In some cases, SR is performed on the bend portion of a tube before welding so that coil manipulation can be performed.

Considering the above scenario and providing your feedback, I personally prefer to qualify PQR with and without PWHT to avoid conflict.

 Thanks and regards,

  Sudalai. M

On Fri, 17 May 2024 at 11:28, Amol Betkar <amolbetkar90@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear Sudalai,

PQR (Procedure Qualification Record) for Boiler Tube Material

For the given materials EN 10216-2 16Mo3 or SA 209 T1 with a thickness of 6.5mm, it's important to consider the appropriate welding consumables, the need for Post Weld Heat Treatment (PWHT), and compliance with relevant standards to ensure the reliability and performance of the welded joints, especially in high-temperature service conditions like those found in boilers.

Welding Consumables

Material Overview:

• EN 10216-2 16Mo3: This is a European specification for seamless tubes of fine-grain steel with specified elevated temperature properties.
• SA 209 T1: This is an ASME specification for seamless carbon-molybdenum alloy-steel boiler and superheater tubes.

Recommended Welding Consumables:

• ER80S-B2 / E8018-B2: These consumables are suitable for welding low alloy steels containing 1.25% Cr and 0.5% Mo, typically used for high-temperature service. They provide good creep resistance and strength at elevated temperatures.
• ER80S-D2 / E7018-A1: These consumables are typically used for carbon-manganese and carbon-molybdenum steels. E7018-A1 is a low-hydrogen electrode suitable for general welding applications but may not provide the necessary high-temperature properties required for boiler tubes.

Considering the service conditions (high temperature) and the material composition, ER80S-B2 / E8018-B2 would be the preferred choice for welding 16Mo3 and SA 209 T1 materials due to their enhanced high-temperature performance.

Post Weld Heat Treatment (PWHT)

Code Requirements:

• ASME Section I & Section VIII: These sections cover the construction of boilers and pressure vessels. For P-Number 1, Group 1 materials, PWHT is not mandatory for thicknesses up to 16mm.

Practical Considerations:

• Stress Relieving after Tube Bending: If the boiler tubes and welded joints will undergo stress relieving after tube bending, this process itself serves as a form of PWHT. Stress relieving can help reduce residual stresses and improve the metallurgical properties of the welded joints.
• Qualification with or without PWHT: Given that stress relieving will be performed after tube bending, you may qualify the PQR without PWHT. However, it is crucial to simulate the actual service conditions during qualification. If stress relieving (acting as PWHT) is a part of the production process, it's recommended to qualify the PQR considering this process to ensure the welding procedure aligns with the final product conditions.

Conclusion

1. Welding Consumable Selection: For high-temperature service like boilers, ER80S-B2 / E8018-B2 consumables are suitable for welding EN 10216-2 16Mo3 and SA 209 T1 materials.
2. PWHT Requirement: Since the boiler tubes and weld joints will undergo stress relieving after tube bending, which serves as a form of PWHT, you may qualify the PQR without PWHT. However, it is advisable to ensure the PQR qualification reflects the stress relieving process to simulate actual service conditions.

By adhering to these guidelines, you can ensure the welds are properly qualified and suitable for the high-temperature service conditions typical in boiler applications.

Regards,

AB

On Fri, 17 May 2024 at 12:14, Sudalai Kannan <sudalaims@gmail.com> wrote:

Greetings Experts,

I would like to know more about PQR qualifications for Boiler tube material EN 10216-2 16Mo3 or SA 209 T1 with 6.5mm Thick,

Welding Consumable: Should  I qualify the above material with ER80S-B2/ E8018-B2 or ER80S-D2 / E7018-A1, or which consumable is suitable for high temperature service like Boiler.

PWHT: As per ASME SEC.I & VIII PWHT is not mandatory for P. No.1 Gr.1 up to 16mm Thick and the Boiler tube and weld joints will undergo the Stress Relieving after tube bending as a coil. in this case Should i qualify the PQR with PWHT or Without PWHT.

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Amol K.B

B.E(Mech), CSWIP 3.2.2, NACE CIP 1 & ASNT LII(4M)

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